Siarad Cumbric

[[e-mail]]

Keldowansik looks more like it's derived wholly from norse
(cf Norwegian Kildeansikt: spring view) and has no celtic element.

Owain is Welsh, but yes, keld, which means a spring, is Norwegian

I'm not sure how you get from "owansik" to "Owain". It's surely easier to
get from "ansik" to "ansikt", however I must brush up on my Norwegian;
it means "face" (noun) not "view" as I just checked. Hmm, maybe that
doesn't

The field-name Keldowansik should not really have been included. Your
explanation is probably right, and if so then it is a good example of
Norn. If it were possible I would love to attempt a reconstruction of
Norn, what lovely words we have from Norn, such as *how for a hill, *fell
for a mountain, *tarn for a lake, *fors for a waterfall, *wath for a ford,
*by for a town, *thorp for a village, *ak for an oak tree, *gawk for a
cuckoo, *sile for a culender, and so on. Your input has solved one problem
for me, the Cumbric form of the Welsh Owain is actually Ewain, pronounced
Ewan, viz. Castel Hewin, the Reconstructed Cumbric of which would be, I
suppose, *Castel Ewain. Thanks for helping me to solve this problem. I
will be starting on philology soon, so every bit of info helps.

make so much sense.

There is more to come, such as the philology of a standard Reconstructed
Cumbric, together with grammar. It will all be free, without copyright.
You
can print it out and sell it to others if you want, or record on CD's
using
a voice reader, or do whatever you want with it.

I wish you success; please post again when you have more.

If you think that you can
do better than I can then you can use my work for the basis of your own
book
on Cumbric.

Sorry, I don't think I can :) I'd be glad to look over anything though if
you want. Not that I'm an expert of course.

The original idea for reconstructing cumbric comes from the
O'Donnel Lectures delivered at the University of Wales, Cardiff. You see,
Cumbric is not the Welsh of Wales, but it is still Welsh, and if people
start using Cumbric they will also use Cymraeg. There are plenty of
non-Saxon parts of England, Cumbria, Lancashire, along the Welsh border
from
Cheshire, Shropshire, Herefordshire, and down to the South-West peninsula
of
England. The idea is to roll back the Saxon tide until there are two
Englands, a Welsh England and a Saxon England. Funnily enough most of the
opposition for this diabolical plot comes not from the Saxon English but
from fellow Celts.

Nice idea; I'm not sure it will work though. Still it's got to be worth a
try!
Personally, I'm pleased to see your work purely from a language and
linguistic

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and the
reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

point of view.
Adrian
--
Adran Cyfrifiadureg, Prifysgol Cymru, aber.
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru ac.
http://users.aber.ac.uk/ais uk

[Hawker]

Keldowansik looks more like it's derived wholly from norse
(cf Norwegian Kildeansikt: spring view) and has no celtic element.

Owain is Welsh, but yes, keld, which means a spring, is Norwegian

I'm not sure how you get from "owansik" to "Owain". It's surely easier to
get from "ansik" to "ansikt", however I must brush up on my Norwegian;
it means "face" (noun) not "view" as I just checked. Hmm, maybe that
doesn't

The field-name Keldowansik should not really have been included. Your
explanation is probably right, and if so then it is a good example of
Norn. If it were possible I would love to attempt a reconstruction of
Norn, what lovely words we have from Norn, such as *how for a hill, *fell
for a mountain, *tarn for a lake, *fors for a waterfall, *wath for a
ford, *by for a town, *thorp for a village, *ak for an oak tree, *gawk
for a cuckoo, *sile for a culender, and so on. Your input has solved one
problem for me, the Cumbric form of the Welsh Owain is actually Ewain,
pronounced Ewan, viz. Castel Hewin, the Reconstructed Cumbric of which
would be, I suppose, *Castel Ewain. Thanks for helping me to solve this
problem. I will be starting on philology soon, so every bit of info
helps.

make so much sense.

There is more to come, such as the philology of a standard Reconstructed
Cumbric, together with grammar. It will all be free, without copyright.
You
can print it out and sell it to others if you want, or record on CD's
using
a voice reader, or do whatever you want with it.

I wish you success; please post again when you have more.

If you think that you can
do better than I can then you can use my work for the basis of your own
book
on Cumbric.

Sorry, I don't think I can :) I'd be glad to look over anything though if
you want. Not that I'm an expert of course.

The original idea for reconstructing cumbric comes from the
O'Donnel Lectures delivered at the University of Wales, Cardiff. You see,
Cumbric is not the Welsh of Wales, but it is still Welsh, and if people
start using Cumbric they will also use Cymraeg. There are plenty of
non-Saxon parts of England, Cumbria, Lancashire, along the Welsh border
from
Cheshire, Shropshire, Herefordshire, and down to the South-West
peninsula of
England. The idea is to roll back the Saxon tide until there are two
Englands, a Welsh England and a Saxon England. Funnily enough most of the
opposition for this diabolical plot comes not from the Saxon English but
from fellow Celts.

Nice idea; I'm not sure it will work though. Still it's got to be worth
a try!
Personally, I'm pleased to see your work purely from a language and
linguistic

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and the
reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

point of view.
Adrian
--
Adran Cyfrifiadureg, Prifysgol Cymru, aber.
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru ac.
http://users.aber.ac.uk/ais uk

Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell lectures
in Cardiff.

[Bob and Doris Jones]

Post by Hawker

Keldowansik looks more like it's derived wholly from norse
(cf Norwegian Kildeansikt: spring view) and has no celtic element.

Owain is Welsh, but yes, keld, which means a spring, is Norwegian

I'm not sure how you get from "owansik" to "Owain". It's surely easier to
get from "ansik" to "ansikt", however I must brush up on my Norwegian;
it means "face" (noun) not "view" as I just checked. Hmm, maybe that
doesn't

The field-name Keldowansik should not really have been included. Your
explanation is probably right, and if so then it is a good example of
Norn. If it were possible I would love to attempt a reconstruction of
Norn, what lovely words we have from Norn, such as *how for a hill, *fell
for a mountain, *tarn for a lake, *fors for a waterfall, *wath for a
ford, *by for a town, *thorp for a village, *ak for an oak tree, *gawk
for a cuckoo, *sile for a culender, and so on. Your input has solved one
problem for me, the Cumbric form of the Welsh Owain is actually Ewain,
pronounced Ewan, viz. Castel Hewin, the Reconstructed Cumbric of which
would be, I suppose, *Castel Ewain. Thanks for helping me to solve this
problem. I will be starting on philology soon, so every bit of info
helps.

make so much sense.

There is more to come, such as the philology of a standard Reconstructed
Cumbric, together with grammar. It will all be free, without copyright.
You
can print it out and sell it to others if you want, or record on CD's
using
a voice reader, or do whatever you want with it.

I wish you success; please post again when you have more.

If you think that you can
do better than I can then you can use my work for the basis of your own
book
on Cumbric.

Sorry, I don't think I can :) I'd be glad to look over anything though if
you want. Not that I'm an expert of course.

The original idea for reconstructing cumbric comes from the
O'Donnel Lectures delivered at the University of Wales, Cardiff. You see,
Cumbric is not the Welsh of Wales, but it is still Welsh, and if people
start using Cumbric they will also use Cymraeg. There are plenty of
non-Saxon parts of England, Cumbria, Lancashire, along the Welsh border
from
Cheshire, Shropshire, Herefordshire, and down to the South-West
peninsula of
England. The idea is to roll back the Saxon tide until there are two
Englands, a Welsh England and a Saxon England. Funnily enough most of the
opposition for this diabolical plot comes not from the Saxon English but
from fellow Celts.

Nice idea; I'm not sure it will work though. Still it's got to be worth
a try!
Personally, I'm pleased to see your work purely from a language and
linguistic

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and the
reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

point of view.
Adrian
--
Adran Cyfrifiadureg, Prifysgol Cymru, aber.
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru ac.
http://users.aber.ac.uk/ais uk

Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell lectures
in Cardiff.

Hi Hawker

How many people can understand, read, write or speak Cumbric now ?

Whare are the classes held ?

Bob

[Walker]

Post by Hawker

Keldowansik looks more like it's derived wholly from norse
(cf Norwegian Kildeansikt: spring view) and has no celtic element.

Owain is Welsh, but yes, keld, which means a spring, is Norwegian

I'm not sure how you get from "owansik" to "Owain". It's surely easier to
get from "ansik" to "ansikt", however I must brush up on my Norwegian;
it means "face" (noun) not "view" as I just checked. Hmm, maybe that
doesn't

The field-name Keldowansik should not really have been included. Your
explanation is probably right, and if so then it is a good example of
Norn. If it were possible I would love to attempt a reconstruction of
Norn, what lovely words we have from Norn, such as *how for a hill,
*fell for a mountain, *tarn for a lake, *fors for a waterfall, *wath for
a ford, *by for a town, *thorp for a village, *ak for an oak tree, *gawk
for a cuckoo, *sile for a culender, and so on. Your input has solved one
problem for me, the Cumbric form of the Welsh Owain is actually Ewain,
pronounced Ewan, viz. Castel Hewin, the Reconstructed Cumbric of which
would be, I suppose, *Castel Ewain. Thanks for helping me to solve this
problem. I will be starting on philology soon, so every bit of info
helps.

make so much sense.

There is more to come, such as the philology of a standard
Reconstructed
Cumbric, together with grammar. It will all be free, without copyright.
You
can print it out and sell it to others if you want, or record on CD's
using
a voice reader, or do whatever you want with it.

I wish you success; please post again when you have more.

If you think that you can
do better than I can then you can use my work for the basis of your own
book
on Cumbric.

Sorry, I don't think I can :) I'd be glad to look over anything though if
you want. Not that I'm an expert of course.

The original idea for reconstructing cumbric comes from the
O'Donnel Lectures delivered at the University of Wales, Cardiff. You see,
Cumbric is not the Welsh of Wales, but it is still Welsh, and if people
start using Cumbric they will also use Cymraeg. There are plenty of
non-Saxon parts of England, Cumbria, Lancashire, along the Welsh border
from
Cheshire, Shropshire, Herefordshire, and down to the South-West
peninsula of
England. The idea is to roll back the Saxon tide until there are two
Englands, a Welsh England and a Saxon England. Funnily enough most of the
opposition for this diabolical plot comes not from the Saxon English but
from fellow Celts.

Nice idea; I'm not sure it will work though. Still it's got to be worth
a try!
Personally, I'm pleased to see your work purely from a language and
linguistic

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and
the reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

point of view.
Adrian
--
Adran Cyfrifiadureg, Prifysgol Cymru, aber.
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru ac.
http://users.aber.ac.uk/ais uk

Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell lectures
in Cardiff.

You are perfectly correct and it was to the credit of this great Celt that
he did so. At presence there is a Celtic renaissance in Northern England,
and even in parts of the North-West Midlands.

[Ciaran]

Post by Walker

Post by Hawker
Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell lectures
in Cardiff.

You are perfectly correct and it was to the credit of this great Celt that
he did so. At presence there is a Celtic renaissance in Northern England,
and even in parts of the North-West Midlands.

Can you be more specific about the details of the "Celtic renaissance in
Northern England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands" ?

How is this Celtic renaissance manfifesting itself ?

Personally, I'm all for it and it goes a long way to re-establishing a
Celtic identity among the English.

[Walker]

Post by Ciaran

Post by Walker

Post by Hawker
Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell
lectures in Cardiff.

You are perfectly correct and it was to the credit of this great Celt
that he did so. At presence there is a Celtic renaissance in Northern
England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands.

Can you be more specific about the details of the "Celtic renaissance in
Northern England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands" ?
How is this Celtic renaissance manfifesting itself ?
Personally, I'm all for it and it goes a long way to re-establishing a
Celtic identity among the English.

You have to get rid of the idea "the English". The people of England are a
varied lot, and it would be just as wrong for the Celtic peoples of England
to impose Celticism upon the Saxon peoples of England, as it was of the
Saxon peoples of England to attempt to Germanise the Celtic peoples of
England. Archeology has now established beyond all doubt that there was
negligible to complete absence of Saxon presence in the Celtic areas of
England. Wales and Scotland are about 100% Celtic, but England has Saxon
areas, Celtic areas, and Celto-Nordic areas. That phrase "the English"
assumes that there are no differences between the peoples of England. I hope
that this information helps you to understand the complexity of English
nationality.

[Ciaran]

Post by Walker

Post by Ciaran

Post by Walker

Post by Hawker
Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell
lectures in Cardiff.

You are perfectly correct and it was to the credit of this great Celt
that he did so. At presence there is a Celtic renaissance in Northern
England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands.

Can you be more specific about the details of the "Celtic renaissance in
Northern England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands" ?
How is this Celtic renaissance manfifesting itself ?
Personally, I'm all for it and it goes a long way to re-establishing a
Celtic identity among the English.

You have to get rid of the idea "the English". The people of England are a
varied lot, and it would be just as wrong for the Celtic peoples of England
to impose Celticism upon the Saxon peoples of England, as it was of the
Saxon peoples of England to attempt to Germanise the Celtic peoples of
England. Archeology has now established beyond all doubt that there was
negligible to complete absence of Saxon presence in the Celtic areas of
England. Wales and Scotland are about 100% Celtic, but England has Saxon
areas, Celtic areas, and Celto-Nordic areas. That phrase "the English"
assumes that there are no differences between the peoples of England. I hope
that this information helps you to understand the complexity of English
nationality.

I understand, because I am up with the latest research on this subject.
The Celtic element comes both from an indigenous component plus a
component from migration (from the west usually). What you say has a lot
of evidence to back it up from modern archaeological, DNA and linguistic
research.

[Walker]

Post by Ciaran

Post by Walker

Post by Ciaran

Post by Walker

Post by Hawker
Well Mr.Welshman, the revival of Cumbric began with the O'Donnell
lectures in Cardiff.

You are perfectly correct and it was to the credit of this great Celt
that he did so. At presence there is a Celtic renaissance in Northern
England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands.

Can you be more specific about the details of the "Celtic renaissance in
Northern England, and even in parts of the North-West Midlands" ?
How is this Celtic renaissance manfifesting itself ?
Personally, I'm all for it and it goes a long way to re-establishing a
Celtic identity among the English.

You have to get rid of the idea "the English". The people of England are
a varied lot, and it would be just as wrong for the Celtic peoples of
England to impose Celticism upon the Saxon peoples of England, as it was
of the Saxon peoples of England to attempt to Germanise the Celtic
peoples of England. Archeology has now established beyond all doubt that
there was negligible to complete absence of Saxon presence in the Celtic
areas of England. Wales and Scotland are about 100% Celtic, but England
has Saxon areas, Celtic areas, and Celto-Nordic areas. That phrase "the
English" assumes that there are no differences between the peoples of
England. I hope that this information helps you to understand the
complexity of English nationality.

I understand, because I am up with the latest research on this subject.
The Celtic element comes both from an indigenous component plus a
component from migration (from the west usually). What you say has a lot
of evidence to back it up from modern archaeological, DNA and linguistic
research.

In certain parts of England, i.e. Germanic England, the link with the Celtic
past was broken, but in other extensive areas of England, i.e. Celtic
England, it was not broken. You can take the example of Serbja and Prussia.
Originally there was a Balto-Slavic people called Prussia (i.e. Robert the
Brus, i.e. Robert the Prussian) and a Slavic people called Serbs (use Sorb
on the search engine). The Prussians were completely Germanised and there
are a few Serbs/Sorbs left in Germany. Germans are able to Germanise people,
and during the Edwardian period this Germanisation was stepped up by
teaching schoolchildren that all of the Celts (with the exception of
Cornwall) were either exterminated or driven out of England either into
Wales, Scotland, or Brittany. Two World Wars with Germany has helped Celtic
England to resist the Germanisation of England and to assert Celtic England:
BE PROUD - SAY IT LOUD - I AM A CELT!

[Hawker]

Keld = Norn spring. Keldow = Cumbric plura -ow on Norn keld. *keldow ansikt
= sight of springs

Keldowansik looks more like it's derived wholly from norse
(cf Norwegian Kildeansikt: spring view) and has no celtic element.

Owain is Welsh, but yes, keld, which means a spring, is Norwegian

I'm not sure how you get from "owansik" to "Owain". It's surely easier to
get from "ansik" to "ansikt", however I must brush up on my Norwegian;
it means "face" (noun) not "view" as I just checked. Hmm, maybe that
doesn't

The field-name Keldowansik should not really have been included. Your
explanation is probably right, and if so then it is a good example of
Norn. If it were possible I would love to attempt a reconstruction of
Norn, what lovely words we have from Norn, such as *how for a hill, *fell
for a mountain, *tarn for a lake, *fors for a waterfall, *wath for a
ford, *by for a town, *thorp for a village, *ak for an oak tree, *gawk
for a cuckoo, *sile for a culender, and so on. Your input has solved one
problem for me, the Cumbric form of the Welsh Owain is actually Ewain,
pronounced Ewan, viz. Castel Hewin, the Reconstructed Cumbric of which
would be, I suppose, *Castel Ewain. Thanks for helping me to solve this
problem. I will be starting on philology soon, so every bit of info
helps.

make so much sense.

There is more to come, such as the philology of a standard Reconstructed
Cumbric, together with grammar. It will all be free, without copyright.
You
can print it out and sell it to others if you want, or record on CD's
using
a voice reader, or do whatever you want with it.

I wish you success; please post again when you have more.

If you think that you can
do better than I can then you can use my work for the basis of your own
book
on Cumbric.

Sorry, I don't think I can :) I'd be glad to look over anything though if
you want. Not that I'm an expert of course.

The original idea for reconstructing cumbric comes from the
O'Donnel Lectures delivered at the University of Wales, Cardiff. You see,
Cumbric is not the Welsh of Wales, but it is still Welsh, and if people
start using Cumbric they will also use Cymraeg. There are plenty of
non-Saxon parts of England, Cumbria, Lancashire, along the Welsh border
from
Cheshire, Shropshire, Herefordshire, and down to the South-West
peninsula of
England. The idea is to roll back the Saxon tide until there are two
Englands, a Welsh England and a Saxon England. Funnily enough most of the
opposition for this diabolical plot comes not from the Saxon English but
from fellow Celts.

Nice idea; I'm not sure it will work though. Still it's got to be worth
a try!
Personally, I'm pleased to see your work purely from a language and
linguistic

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and the
reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

point of view.
Adrian
--
Adran Cyfrifiadureg, Prifysgol Cymru, aber.
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru ac.
http://users.aber.ac.uk/ais uk

[David]

The people of Wales, secure in their nationhood as a seperate political
entity from England, have not been subjected to the kind of cultural and
historical genocide that people have endured in Northern England, or
Brigantia. There is a growing awareness in Brigantia that we are not
Anglo-Saxons, we are basically Celts with a dash of Scandinavian, and
the reconstruction of our ancient Celtic language will go a long way to
redressing the balence. I have included uk.local.cumbria because I got a
reply there, and perhaps the local folk might want to get in touch with
their Scandinavian and Celtic roots instead of accepting a false London
based Anglo-Saxon identity.

Karaiki ehoa, you beat the old drum.
Are the British (NOT Celts) Irish or Scottish Cumbric, Cormish, Manx etc
consitututionally different from the Anglo-Saxon and the Norman?

Hard to argue either way. However, coming from our last colony really
here in NewZealand, west from Patagonia and the falklands I will over
this experience.

With us came our sheep cattle and dogs. Most came from specific
localities- Jersey or Fresian cows Merino or romney sheep.
(The dogs are a bit more mixed up.)

All these stock have different characterics- beef vs milk for example...
they seem to slot into habitats which resemble the places they came from.

Well, people ought to be the same... A lot have been urbanised for
generations
and have gone a lot more like the dogs...

I will give you good example- welsh descendents in Justice in NZ.

Sian Elias is the chief Justice in NZ.
Judith Ablett kerr is a prominent QC (from South Wales.)

Peter Ellis (Welsh surname) was convicted of ritual abuse in a celebrated
case
in Christchurch New Zealand.

Arthur Allan Thomas was the most celebrated man convicted of murder and then
pardoned.
His father was called Allan Glendower Thomas.

Okay, as they say one swallow doesn't make a spring.

I have met a man in our church from Cumbria who can count in Welsh, or close
to it.
A living remnant of the old language retained amongst shepherds...

...thats enough for me.

One key- don't try and use the Saesneg method of research and reasoning-

the links are there...

and a lot of pitfalls too LOL

Dyma'r twca, lle mae'r wain?

Dafydd
Lle welyn
Seland newydd.

[Dafydd]

Noswaith dda Cwmbru,

Does anyone have a Cumbric dictionary in the making. It would be good
if it was available for everyone to learn Cumbric. And is there any
grammar that as been decided upon. I noticed that mutations were
thought to follow the Cornish/Breton way. Is it going to be similar to
Welsh or Cornish or Breton or a mix of the three. What evidence as the
research into Cumbric words thrown on the subject.

Hope to hear a reply

Daf